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gliddenralston
03-03-2011, 08:36 AM
Gross, On Wednesday March 2, 2011, 2:19 pm EST

With the U.S. facing large, structural deficits, analysts of all stripes are taking an inventory of the nation's assets and liabilities. Mary Meeker, famed for her coverage of Internet stocks, has produced a long presentation on the nation's balance sheet, as if it were a private-sector company. Historian Niall Ferguson suggests in Newsweek that the U.S. start selling off some of its assets. "The U.S. government currently has $233 billion worth of non-defense 'property, plant and equipment'," he noted. Plus there's land, power-generating assets and roads. (As if somebody would buy I-95).

On Tuesday, word came that President Obama is set to propose setting up a board to look at whether the U.S. can sell off some of its real estate holdings, a move that might raise some $15 billion.

But they're missing a big source. To quote the Seinfeld character Kenny Bania: "That's gold, Jerry. Gold!"

For a good chunk of its modern history, the U.S. was on the gold standard. That meant the Treasury and central bank had to keep a ready supply of the metal on hand in case anybody wanted to turn in paper money for bullion. While the U.S. left the gold standard for good in 1973, it has held on to its stash of what economist John Maynard Keynes called a "barbarous relic." And so there's lots of it lying around, in Fort Knox in the fortress-like Federal Reserve Bank of New York, in various U.S. Mint operations. Some of it is used to make gold coins. But most of it is in bullion. Tons of it

As of January 31, the government had 2.9 million troy ounces of gold coins and nearly 259 million troy ounces of gold bullion, for a total of 261.5 million troy ounces. (There are 14.583 troy ounces in a pound).

The government's reports on gold holdings can be seen here.

The gold stash represents an enormous storehouse of value. That's because the government carries gold on its balance sheet at a book value of just $42.2222 per troy ounce, which was the price of gold in 1973 when Richard Nixon decoupled it from the U.S. currency. But gold trades today at about $1,433 per troy ounce. The upshot: Although it is loath to admit it, the U.S. has about $375 billion worth of gold.

The Red, White and Yellow Metal

So what should be done with this asset? At the very least, the U.S. should consider marking its position to the market, rather than to the 1973 price of gold. If the Fed and the Treasury were to write up the value of their gold holdings, it would certainly improve the ratio between national assets and national liabilities. (Meeker's dire analysis, for example, doesn't seem to account for the present-day value of the nation's gold.)

Other countries may already be moving in that direction. The Financial Times reported on Tuesday that Italian banks are pressuring the Italian central bank to do just that with its reserve gold. The reasoning: Italy's banks hold shares in the central bank. Having those shares reflect the market value of the assets held by the central bank might spare private banks from having to raise fresh capital.

(While we're at it, here's another asset the taxpayers have that frequently goes uncounted: The Strategic Petroleum Reserve currently has 726.5 million barrels, divided between 292.5 million barrels of sweet crude and 434 million barrels of sour crude. With oil at $100 per barrel, that's worth $72.65 billion.)

For obvious reasons, the U.S. needs to hold on to its emergency supply of oil. But why not consider selling at least some of the gold? The International Monetary Fund in 2009 authorized the sale of about 13.7 million ounces, or about 12 percent of its holdings. It has since sold a large chunk of its holdings (200 metric tons) to India's central bank, and in February 2010 began to sell gold into the market. Those sales haven't hampered the ability of the IMF to perform its role, and they haven't sandbagged the gold market.

The U.S. isn't going back to the gold standard anytime soon (sorry, Ron Paul & Co.) and it costs money to secure the heavy metal. We need the money badly, and we'd be selling into a very hot market. Critics (including Rep. Paul) have charged that policies of the Federal Reserve have hurt consumers and taxpayers by boosting the money supply and contributing to the rise in price of hard assets like gold. But America's taxpayers collectively own nearly 9,000 tons of the precious metal. If the government simply marked this asset to current market values, taxpayers would become among the biggest beneficiaries of the rise in gold.

Of course, there are plenty of good reasons not to sell off our national treasure. Asset sales are a classic one-shot technique — they improve the current year fiscal situation while papering over recurring structural problems. Plus, even if the U.S. were to dump all its gold tomorrow at the current price, the revenues would only cover a small chunk of this year's deficit. And while currencies come and go, gold has been the agreed-upon storehouse of value for millennium. Ultimately, it's a bad idea to hold a clearance sale on the nation's gold for the same reason it would be to sell off Yellowstone Park or the Tennessee Valley Authority. All represent valuable assets that were intended to be held in trust for future generations.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/America-Secret-365-Billion-dg-3407878258.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=9&asset=&ccode=

gliddenralston
03-03-2011, 08:42 AM
Can you believe it? this guy believes Fort Knox is full of gold an if it were, how long would 365 billion last? a couple months maybe.

tekhen
03-03-2011, 08:46 AM
Confiscate and sell has been going on for a while now...

Here is one example of several
Treasury Auctions (http://www.treasury.gov/services/Pages/auctions_index.aspx)

Oldmansmith
03-03-2011, 08:53 AM
Wow, that is a GREAT idea! Forget cutting spending, maybe I should sell MY gold and that way I can keep borrowing money to buy crap I don't need.

Argent Dragon
03-03-2011, 09:21 AM
But why not consider selling at least some of the gold?

IF the government decides to sell whatever little gold is in their custody (although it's the citizens gold collectively in ownership), we kiss goodbye any threads of hope that the US will remain as great as she was in the glory days of the Republic.

Sad article IMO.

Irons
03-03-2011, 09:34 AM
Any gold that used to be there is long gone, if there is any around the US doesn't own it.~:vollkommenauf:

gliddenralston
03-03-2011, 10:00 AM
Any gold that used to be there is long gone, if there is any around the US doesn't own it.~:vollkommenauf:

hear tell u got more gold than Knox...where did that boat sink?

Irons
03-03-2011, 10:04 AM
hear tell u got more gold than Knox...where did that boat sink?

Silly rumer, the imaginations running wild around here boggles the mind.

phideaux
03-03-2011, 10:07 AM
Even if the gold is in Ft. Knoxious (it ain't), $365 billion is a drop in the Federal ocean. $365 billion is about 6 weelks of spending by the criminals in Washington, DC.

Usc96
03-03-2011, 10:09 AM
First, is there really gold in ft know? Second, who owns the gold? The fed? Other countries? Third, is is already collateral for something? Is it leased? Fourth, it won't be worth $1,430 if we flood the market with it. Fifth, isn't this what Gordon brown and his countrymen now regret doing with UK's gold?

argentos
03-03-2011, 10:49 AM
.... isn't this what Gordon brown and his countrymen now regret doing with UK's gold?



Not exactly. Gordon still thinks he did the right thing. The countrymen thought he was daft long before he sold the gold - at the point where he gave early warning that he would be selling hundreds of tons of gold. The gold price in £s plummeted in anticipation of the yellow deluge, precisely as the countrypersons had expected. Pillock.

moonshot5
03-03-2011, 11:42 AM
Not exactly. Gordon still thinks he did the right thing. The countrymen thought he was daft long before he sold the gold - at the point where he gave early warning that he would be selling hundreds of tons of gold. The gold price in £s plummeted in anticipation of the yellow deluge, precisely as the countrypersons had expected. Pillock.

Brown's sale of gold marked the absolute low in the price of gold.

This is known as the "Brown Bottom". :haha:

Argent Dragon
03-03-2011, 11:59 AM
First, is there really gold in ft know? Second, who owns the gold? The fed? Other countries? Third, is is already collateral for something? Is it leased? Fourth, it won't be worth $1,430 if we flood the market with it. Fifth, isn't this what Gordon brown and his countrymen now regret doing with UK's gold?

#1 - Without an updated 'Audit' we cannot know. Yet, supposedly there's a few thousand tonnes there to make up the supposed 8,000+ tonnes the US has.
#2 - I suspect JP-Morgan and other banksters under the FED with past agreements made back in the early 1970's to dupe .Gov out of its gold to shoulder debt.
#3 - yes, it's collateral for debt but without ties to the US Dollar..........think of a collateral 'loan' and Nixon and bankruptcy........banksters win again !
#4 - It would be interesting to see a 'flood' but even 400+ tonnes released by the IMF some years ago (per year) didn't stop gold from rising in price (because the dollar is doomed).
#5 - I don't have an answer for this one..........better ask Mr.Brown in person.

gilmoujr
03-03-2011, 12:19 PM
isn't this what Gordon brown and his countrymen now regret doing with UK's gold?

Exactly what I was thinking when I read the OP.

budfox
03-03-2011, 12:30 PM
Sell off 15 billion in Real Estate?? Don't we spend that much per minute now??

Turner-son
03-03-2011, 12:39 PM
None of you actually read the article, did you? Here is a quote:

"Of course, there are plenty of good reasons not to sell off our national treasure. Asset sales are a classic one-shot technique — they improve the current year fiscal situation while papering over recurring structural problems. Plus, even if the U.S. were to dump all its gold tomorrow at the current price, the revenues would only cover a small chunk of this year's deficit. And while currencies come and go, gold has been the agreed-upon storehouse of value for millennium. Ultimately, it's a bad idea to hold a clearance sale on the nation's gold for the same reason it would be to sell off Yellowstone Park or the Tennessee Valley Authority. All represent valuable assets that were intended to be held in trust for future generations."

That paragraph makes the exact same arguments that we do. The author is simply suggesting marking the asset to market, instead of the 1970's price (thus increasing the value of each ounce from $42.xx to $14xx.xx). It's simply an artificial way of improving the asset to liability ratio. That's all.

Argent Dragon
03-03-2011, 12:50 PM
None of you actually read the article, did you? ......

That paragraph makes the exact same arguments that we do. The author is simply suggesting marking the asset to market, instead of the 1970's price (thus increasing the value of each ounce from $42.xx to $14xx.xx). It's simply an artificial way of improving the asset to liability ratio. That's all.

Great clarification Turner-son. I learned back in high school that if you're going to 'skim' an article - always read the last paragraph to get the point.

Also, might I add - I sincerely hope the US does own most of its gold out of that 8,000+ tonnes because it was rightfully earned by our fathers & grandfathers during WWII. The US tripled its gold reserve holdings during the course of that war.

Aurumag
03-03-2011, 05:39 PM
...I sincerely hope the US does own most of its gold out of that 8,000+ tonnes ...

Didn't Bubba Bill sell all but the veneer of the Ft. Tungsten Au in order to "balance the budget" in time for his second term?

Even if there is gold worth $365 GigaFRNs, our most-favored debtor will likely lay hold of it when the music stops.

Usc96
03-03-2011, 08:00 PM
None of you actually read the article, did you? Here is a quote:

"Of course, there are plenty of good reasons not to sell off our national treasure. Asset sales are a classic one-shot technique — they improve the current year fiscal situation while papering over recurring structural problems. Plus, even if the U.S. were to dump all its gold tomorrow at the current price, the revenues would only cover a small chunk of this year's deficit. And while currencies come and go, gold has been the agreed-upon storehouse of value for millennium. Ultimately, it's a bad idea to hold a clearance sale on the nation's gold for the same reason it would be to sell off Yellowstone Park or the Tennessee Valley Authority. All represent valuable assets that were intended to be held in trust for future generations."

That paragraph makes the exact same arguments that we do. The author is simply suggesting marking the asset to market, instead of the 1970's price (thus increasing the value of each ounce from $42.xx to $14xx.xx). It's simply an artificial way of improving the asset to liability ratio. That's all.

All due respect, but that last paragraph seemed like an afterthought summary of opposing arguments and not a reasoned conclusion based on the preceding ten paragraphs.

andial
03-03-2011, 08:09 PM
Soon the fed will mark it's Gold assets to the market price. They need the money like everyone else. Right now on their balance sheet the Fed's supposed Gold is valued at around 11 billion dollars priced at 42 bucks an ounce.

AceNZ
03-03-2011, 08:42 PM
Assuming for the moment that the gold is still being held by the Fed and hasn't secretly been transferred away (loaned or stolen), there are a few issues that article in the OP neglects to mention:

1. A mark-to-market in the price of gold would result in an associated profit to the Fed. The Fed, in turn, is required to rebate their profits back to the Treasury. So, if they had a $300B paper profit, they would have to give the Treasury that much.
2. Due to the above, I believe the Fed will wait until their balance sheet shows serious problems, then mark the gold to market to offset the issue.
3. During WWII, most foreign countries would not accept dollars as payment for war supplies; they would only accept gold. If the world goes to war again, the Fed's ability to create money from thin air could quickly become immaterial when it comes to acquiring materiel from other countries.
4. Central banks primarily hold gold for a particular reason: as insurance against a collapse of their currency (which is the same as a big part of the reason why individuals should hold gold).
5. Many central banks have been selling gold over the last few decades; those who don't will have a strategic advantage when TSHTF.

andial
03-03-2011, 09:05 PM
1. A mark-to-market in the price of gold would result in an associated profit to the Fed. The Fed, in turn, is required to rebate their profits back to the Treasury. So, if they had a $300B paper profit, they would have to give the Treasury that much.


Or the Treasury just might ask the Fed to buy more Treasury bonds with it's new found profits. Just speculating.