Proshares and Ultra Proshares

[keepitlow]

Interested in the PM and crude Ultra Proshares.

Anyone use them. Do they even own anything? Or is it all illusion betting?

As long as the house of cards don't collapse, would you say they are safe vehicles to spec in?

[Eat Beef]

ALL the leveraged ETFs tend toward zero over time. Volatility kills them, and if you plan on holding them over time you'll more than likely lose money.

They're OK for day trades, but the way they're structured assures that they'll all end up worthless eventually.

IOW, don't be caught long leveraged ETFs.

[Joegoog23]

EXTREMELY easy vehicles to make VERY quick profits playing both sides while we are rangebound. Been cleaning house for over 3 years in ULTRAETF's now.

[EO 11110]

i'm riding agq - leveraged silver right now

the long term hold on these sux....math gets in the way

also do some trading with the pst, tbt - leveraged US bond

i agree with eat beef - short term only - months is max term

as for the safety aspect -- i've read that etn's are inferior to etf's.....i guess one more layer of vapor between them

[Joegoog23]

They way I play them is (in ur example) i trade both AGQ and ZSL, acquiring each on pullbacks to support levels. That way i'm always booking profits in one and using those proceeds to buy the other. You have to find a pair that is in a trading range and there is absolutely no way to lose money.

i'm riding agq - leveraged silver right now

the long term hold on these sux....math gets in the way

also do some trading with the pst, tbt - leveraged US bond

i agree with eat beef - short term only - months is max term

as for the safety aspect -- i've read that etn's are inferior to etf's.....i guess one more layer of vapor between them

[Joegoog23]

When u get "caught' in a long term pullback, there will still be a trading range to be found and you need to focus on that range until the AGQ breaks back out.

[EO 11110]

When u get "caught' in a long term pullback, there will still be a trading range to be found and you need to focus on that range until the AGQ breaks back out.

i'm not much of a trader -- just taking advantage of the manipulation

with today's move i'm up 40% over the last couple of weeks...and we aren't even near $40 per ounce

thanks for the margin raises + naked shorts

me love the pigmen