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Thread: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

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    Default How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    I was just thinking about the upcoming federal mandate for all new vehicles to have "black boxes" installed starting next year. Are you guys aware of any rogue experiments on disabling such data boxes? Are there ways to work around the boxes to keep cars running without them?
    When I die, I'm going to be cremated and have my ashes put into a can of coffee creamer. But I'll have the last laugh. I hate cream in my coffee.

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Chances are it will be an integral part of the CPU that runs the car, so removing it will be impossible. What you'll start to see will be similar to the aftermarket "tuner" chips commonly seen in car magazines. However, since removing the original Big Brother chips will probably carry penalties, I would expect genuine "trackless" chips to be expensive, and underground, purchases. And, because they'll be grey/black market items, you'll not be able to tell if the offending software really isn't present, since you won't be able to complain about being ripped off...
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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Just buy an old car and fix it up. It'll be nicer and cheaper.



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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    It will probably be a crime punishable by ...

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Yeah, just carry a thermite grenade in the truck for use in case of emergencies.
    And have a well rehearsed story about terrorists attacking you.
    After all, we are lead to believe by authorities that terrorists are everywhere on our soil.

    Do you think they'll "buy back from you" what they try to sell you?


    lol.

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Just to let you know, our company is experimenting with a device that plugs in to the test plug under the dash and will track where the vehicle went, how you're driving it and vehicle condition. It's designed for fleet tracking. They're supposed to be sending me a weekly e-mail about how I'm driving but they never have. It downloads via cell system.
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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Wouldn't a tracking device have to be able to communicate with satellites? If so, would wrapping the device in aluminum foil hinder it?

    Are they doing this so that the citizens can know where the banksters are at all times or so that the banksters can know where the citizens are at all times?
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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ag lining View Post
    Yeah, just carry a thermite grenade in the truck for use in case of emergencies.
    And have a well rehearsed story about terrorists attacking you.
    After all, we are lead to believe by authorities that terrorists are everywhere on our soil.

    Do you think they'll "buy back from you" what they try to sell you?


    lol.
    what if they transmit telemetry ?
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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Just get an older Jeep Wrangler. Good all around vehicle.

    All this tech is juuuuuust soooo intrusive!

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Quote Originally Posted by hoarder View Post
    Wouldn't a tracking device have to be able to communicate with satellites? If so, would wrapping the device in aluminum foil hinder it?

    Are they doing this so that the citizens can know where the banksters are at all times or so that the banksters can know where the citizens are at all times?
    use lead foil of the apropreaite gauge .
    IF YA CANT DAZZLE THEM WITH BRILLIANCE BAFFLE THEM WITH BULLsh!t.

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    write you own efi and spark maps or dl your vehicle map from the comminity
    Www.megasquirt.info

    MegaSquirt® EFI Controller will provide fuel control on one to 16 or more injectors, of high or low impedance, and for any number of cylinders, even three and five cylinder engines and odd-fire engines. If you have MegaSquirt-II,electronic control of number of ignition systems are supported, including: 7 or 8-pin HEI from General Motors, EDIS from Ford, TFI from Ford, or you can control a single coil directly. For fuel only control, you can trigger off the coil's negative terminal.

    Or flash ecu.

    For myself its a carbed sbc.

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Quote Originally Posted by brosil View Post
    Just to let you know, our company is experimenting with a device that plugs in to the test plug under the dash and will track where the vehicle went, how you're driving it and vehicle condition. It's designed for fleet tracking. They're supposed to be sending me a weekly e-mail about how I'm driving but they never have. It downloads via cell system.
    Will strong magnets skew the readings? There has to be a way to at least throw off the data that these devices are transmitting, if not disable them.
    When I die, I'm going to be cremated and have my ashes put into a can of coffee creamer. But I'll have the last laugh. I hate cream in my coffee.

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Where this is already extensively used is in the trucking industry, and is called "Fleet Management". It's about improving efficiency.
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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    One more caveat. You guys act like this is sonething new. GM has been doing this for years with "on star". Offered for free with most new gms

    There have been numerous instances of onstar listening in on coversations all ready. Of course they also call the cops with your gps coords ehen the air bags go off.

    Ive never had enough money for a new car so....

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Quote Originally Posted by honu5050 View Post
    use lead foil of the apropreaite gauge .
    Use lead for nuclear shielding. X-rays and such.

    For radio and microwaves, use copper, or silver if you want to get fancy. You want a good electrical conductor, and lead ain't so good.

    But that still won't stop the computer from recording speed, direction, acceleration, throttle position, braking, steering, etc. etc. etc.

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Quote Originally Posted by AgBar View Post
    But that still won't stop the computer from recording speed, direction, acceleration, throttle position, braking, steering, etc. etc. etc.
    I don't think there are steering position sensors and the copper might shield compass readings.
    One concern about wrapping electronic devices in foil is overheating. A greater hurdle is knowing which component has the black box in it and where it's located.
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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    if you disable it the car wont be able to drive itself

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Quote Originally Posted by hoarder View Post
    I don't think there are steering position sensors and the copper might shield compass readings.
    I don't know if there are, now that you mention it. But they'd be easy enough to add, I imagine.

    Copper won't block more-or-less-static magnetic fields like Earth's. For that, you'd need something with a very high magnetic permeability, like a mu-metal, but even that won't be completely effective without proper design (layering, shape, thickness, etc.).

    EDIT: of course, if you knew where the compass was, you could set up an external field (fixed or electro-magnet) to make the thing think it was always going "North."

    Accelerometers could still be used to report "turned 15 degrees left" or some such. I don't know of any way to defeat those without inventing anti-gravity.


    (at least insofar as passive measures go...)




    One concern about wrapping electronic devices in foil is overheating. A greater hurdle is knowing which component has the black box in it and where it's located.
    Absolutely. Add to that: at the higher frequencies, even a small-ish gap in the shielding can let the EM leak through. Proper shielding is easier said than done, honestly.
    Last edited by AgBar; 03-09-2013 at 12:45 AM.

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    Default GPS tracking devices helped find stolen buses

    By Peter Nickeas. Carlos Sadovi and Rachael Levy Tribune reporters 3:28 p.m. CST, March 8, 2013

    Eight school buses were stolen from the Far South Side overnight and driven to a salvage yard, where they were cut apart and shredded into a two-story pile of scrap, police said.

    The name of the Sunrise bus company could be seen among the shards of metal at SRV Metal Scrapper, 3405 S. Lawndale Avenue, police said. Four people were taken into custody, including the owner of the company.

    The 40-foot-long buses, capable of seating 75 people, were stolen sometime overnight from the bus company's yard in the 10000 block of South Torrence Avenue and were not discovered missing until this morning, police said.

    The buses were all equipped with GPS tracking devices, and police were able to track "their entire movement" to the scrap yard on the West Side, police said.

    When officers arrived, several people who apparently worked in the scrap yard ran into a building, police said. Officers initially apprehended one person and later took two others into custody. The owner was arrested in the afternoon.

    "There was a pile of shredded school buses about two-stories high," one police official said. Some pieces were large enough that police could see the "Sunrise bus logo," the official said.

    Engines and transmissions from the buses had already been cut in half, and the seats tossed in a "big pile of scrap."
    Area Central Commander Eugene Roy said the metal will be impounded as evidence. “It was unusual to see such a large-scale theft,” he said.

    An employee said the bus yard had been closed around 7 p.m. Thursday. When workers arrived at 5 a.m. today, they discovered a gate open and a snapped lock. Police arrived at the scrap yard around 6 a.m.
    Greg Bonnett, president and co-owner of Sunrise, said he was awakened this morning with a call from a worker that the buses had been stolen.

    When the GPS signals were tracked down to the West Side, Bonnett said he expected to find 8 buses parked there. "We expected to come in and see our buses, not a mound of scrap.

    "In 40 years I have never heard of anything like this," said Bonnett, 60.


    •Related
    • Photos: Stolen buses found in salvage yard
    • Video: Scrap pile of stolen buses
    • School bus remnants



    Bonnett estimated his loss at a quarter of a million dollars. Four of the buses were equipped for special education students, including wheelchair lifts, he said. Four 2009 models, three were 2004 and one was a 2003.

    As scrap, the buses would have been worth anywhere from $1,500 to $3,500 each.

    "I don't know why they would do it," said Joe Pickard, chief economist for the Institute of Scrap Recycling Industries in Washington, D.C. "It seems like a lot of effort for not a big return. What would motivate an individual, (they're) school buses."

    Scrap prices for iron and steel are relatively low right now. They bring about 18 cents per pound compared to about $3.50 per pound for copper and about 90 cents per pound for aluminum, Pickard said.

    Even with the buses weighing 17,000 to 20,000 pounds, much of that would be from wiring, foam, rubber and materials from the seats, Pickard said.

    But Gary Bush, who was a police officer for 32 years before he began keeping track of thefts for the institute, said thieves will take whatever they can. "Anything that can be stolen, has been stolen," he said. "Literally anything of any value is a potential target."
    Sunrise has about 260 buses, and the company was able to get buses to its schools. "No Sunrise kids missed school," Bonnett said. "Equipment is equipment. It's easy to replace."
    chicagobreaking@tribune.com
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    Default Re: GPS tracking devices helped find stolen buses

    Quote Originally Posted by hoarder View Post
    By Peter Nickeas. Carlos Sadovi and Rachael Levy Tribune reporters 3:28 p.m. CST, March 8, 2013

    Eight school buses were stolen from the Far South Side overnight and driven to a salvage yard, where they were cut apart and shredded into a two-story pile of scrap, police said.

    The name of the Sunrise bus company could be seen among the shards of metal at SRV Metal Scrapper, 3405 S. Lawndale Avenue, police said. Four people were taken into custody, including the owner of the company.

    The 40-foot-long buses, capable of seating 75 people, were stolen sometime overnight from the bus company's yard in the 10000 block of South Torrence Avenue and were not discovered missing until this morning, police said.

    The buses were all equipped with GPS tracking devices, and police were able to track "their entire movement" to the scrap yard on the West Side, police said.

    When officers arrived, several people who apparently worked in the scrap yard ran into a building, police said. Officers initially apprehended one person and later took two others into custody. The owner was arrested in the afternoon.

    "There was a pile of shredded school buses about two-stories high," one police official said. Some pieces were large enough that police could see the "Sunrise bus logo," the official said.

    Engines and transmissions from the buses had already been cut in half, and the seats tossed in a "big pile of scrap."
    Area Central Commander Eugene Roy said the metal will be impounded as evidence. “It was unusual to see such a large-scale theft,” he said.

    An employee said the bus yard had been closed around 7 p.m. Thursday. When workers arrived at 5 a.m. today, they discovered a gate open and a snapped lock. Police arrived at the scrap yard around 6 a.m.
    Greg Bonnett, president and co-owner of Sunrise, said he was awakened this morning with a call from a worker that the buses had been stolen.

    When the GPS signals were tracked down to the West Side, Bonnett said he expected to find 8 buses parked there. "We expected to come in and see our buses, not a mound of scrap.

    "In 40 years I have never heard of anything like this," said Bonnett, 60.


    •Related
    • Photos: Stolen buses found in salvage yard
    • Video: Scrap pile of stolen buses
    • School bus remnants



    Bonnett estimated his loss at a quarter of a million dollars. Four of the buses were equipped for special education students, including wheelchair lifts, he said. Four 2009 models, three were 2004 and one was a 2003.

    As scrap, the buses would have been worth anywhere from $1,500 to $3,500 each.

    "I don't know why they would do it," said Joe Pickard, chief economist for the Institute of Scrap Recycling Industries in Washington, D.C. "It seems like a lot of effort for not a big return. What would motivate an individual, (they're) school buses."

    Scrap prices for iron and steel are relatively low right now. They bring about 18 cents per pound compared to about $3.50 per pound for copper and about 90 cents per pound for aluminum, Pickard said.

    Even with the buses weighing 17,000 to 20,000 pounds, much of that would be from wiring, foam, rubber and materials from the seats, Pickard said.

    But Gary Bush, who was a police officer for 32 years before he began keeping track of thefts for the institute, said thieves will take whatever they can. "Anything that can be stolen, has been stolen," he said. "Literally anything of any value is a potential target."
    Sunrise has about 260 buses, and the company was able to get buses to its schools. "No Sunrise kids missed school," Bonnett said. "Equipment is equipment. It's easy to replace."
    chicagobreaking@tribune.com
    Impound it for eveidence n' ship the WTC metal to india n' china asap....
    IF YA CANT DAZZLE THEM WITH BRILLIANCE BAFFLE THEM WITH BULLsh!t.

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cigarlover View Post
    if you disable it the car wont be able to drive itself
    for those of you concerned about this invasive products commie aspect get a stun gun with max output figure out the right wires and run a zap through it "AFTER" a problem. it should knock out all data .
    IF YA CANT DAZZLE THEM WITH BRILLIANCE BAFFLE THEM WITH BULLsh!t.

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    Default Re: How easy will it be to disable upcoming "black boxes" on cars and trucks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickelless View Post

    There has to be a way to at least throw off the data that these devices are transmitting, if not disable them.

    There is. Just crash it into the side of a skyscraper.

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