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Istanbul Gold Refinery bars

Discussion in 'Purchasing Precious Metals' started by wischeese, Jun 15, 2011.



  1. wischeese

    wischeese New Member

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    I was looking around on ebay tonight at bullion gold bars and saw alot of bars from Istanbul Gold Refinery. I never heard of this out fit before.

    Are these worth picking up or should I stick to more established names?

    I did pick up my first gold today at the coin shop. Exciting stuff.
    [​IMG]

    Uploaded with ImageShack.us
     
    pezking7p and Irons like this.
  2. latemetal

    latemetal Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Turkish gold tends to be .995 instead of .999, other than that, I buy it when the price is right.
     
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  3. Irons

    Irons Deep Sixed Mother Lode

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    Istanbul Refinery bars are a great buy and a long established mint. Gold is gold so hunt for the best price as always.
     
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  4. wischeese

    wischeese New Member

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    Good point, some of the bars I've seen are .995. Need to take a close look.
     
  5. Irons

    Irons Deep Sixed Mother Lode

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    There was a bunch of small gold bars that were encased in a credit card size plastic card called chipgold a while ago, and they were .995 like latemetal mentioned.

    I forgot about them, they were popular around 3 years ago.

    Good catch late, :ok: my TY button disappeared.
     
  6. ~BS

    ~BS Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    theyre legit, as long as they're not plated copies.
     
  7. HistoryStudent

    HistoryStudent Midas Member Midas Member

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    GOLD coins:

    AGE
    Maples
    Krugs
    Mexican
    Sovereigns
    Nuggets

    ONLY (because) sooner or later you have to sell them.
     
  8. ~BS

    ~BS Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    995 shouldn't make a difference. at least it didn't when I sold a couple to apmex a while back.
     
  9. pezking7p

    pezking7p Seeker Seeker

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    Congrats on your first gold buy!

    But beware, you may find yourself laying awake at night thinking about your next purchase....You will soon understand all the people from history who ever went crazy trying to get more gold.
     
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  10. Oz Waver

    Oz Waver Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    The hallmark "essayeur fondeur" is the highest in the world, there are different kinds. It's on Pamp, Credit Suisse, Valcambi, Metalor etc.
    LBMA recognised and truly international.

    My opinion is usually gold is gold, but you should be selective. Personally I've avoid Istanbul, Chinese and other stuff. Stick with more recognised stuff at low premiums (there's enough around still).
     
  11. argentos

    argentos Former Boat Owner Gold Chaser

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    There are apparently only two Turkish Associate members of the LBMA and neither is "Istanbul Gold Refinery".

     
  12. Not Sure

    Not Sure Banned

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    Istanbul Mint products are cheaper for a reason. They might be real, but their resaleability will be more difficulty. I won't buy them, for example. Wasn't there some issue with Goldas products (also from Turkey, e.g., ChipGold) in recent years, regarding overstated purity?

    Stick with a real European or American refiner, if you want bars. But keep in mind the serial numbers on them track both ways. That's why coins are better.
     
  13. Mr. Shiny

    Mr. Shiny Silver Member Silver Miner

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    Really? The French words for assayer & founder (one who casts metals [as in] a foundry) are a hallmark? The 'highest in the world'? Really?
     
  14. Gcubed

    Gcubed Banned

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    Well, that's what the man said! I wonder if he knows wtf he's talking about? He sure was giving the Perth Mint hell a while ago! :confused:
     
  15. Oz Waver

    Oz Waver Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Yes. Really.
    http://www.lbma.org.uk/pages/index.cfm?page_id=29

    Swiss gold is arguably the most respected and recognised in the world. This hallmark is good on pretty much all world exchanges and recognised universally, it is IMHO unrivalled, Johnson Matthey is second. I've included the LBMA link. There are a few varieties of this assay mark depending on the fabricator.

    Perth Mint is also on the list.

    You'll find many fabricators that aren't.

    Would you care to share your thoughts? Do you dispute this or have an issue with it?
     
  16. jogslvr

    jogslvr Gold Miser Gold Chaser

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  17. Gcubed

    Gcubed Banned

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    A hallmark is a "maker mark". "essayeur fondeur" is a statement of their business or profession. ;)
     
  18. Gcubed

    Gcubed Banned

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    They have been around for a long time. I've heard they may make the jump to being a "good delivery" refinery.
     
  19. Oz Waver

    Oz Waver Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    We can call it a stamp, but seeing you want to be pedantic about it...

    1hall·mark noun \ˈhȯl-ˌmärk\
    1
    a : an official mark stamped on gold and silver articles in England to attest their purity
    b : a mark or device placed or stamped on an article of trade to indicate origin, purity, or genuineness

    Your response? :)
     
  20. Gcubed

    Gcubed Banned

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    A bit of clarity.

    A "hallmark" is the makers "signature", so to speak.

    A "quality mark" is a statement of purity.

    "essayeur fondeur" is neither.
     
  21. Oz Waver

    Oz Waver Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Your really pushing this one up hill just to be argumentative. And I think your wrong.

    Here's a link from people that should know.

    http://www.valcambi.com/products/castbars.asp

    Why Valcambi for cast bars?
    The assayer stamp is a guarantee of the quality of Swiss workmanship. It guarantees the most sought after bars in the world, desired by precious metals connoisseurs and investors alike.
     
  22. Gcubed

    Gcubed Banned

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    I'm just stating the truth of the matter. The "assayer stamp" is the "hallmark". Go back to class. Have a good day!

    'cubed
     
  23. Oz Waver

    Oz Waver Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Really???
    I provided you with a definition, links to LBMA, and a quote that meets the definition. I deal with metals and dealers daily.

    Go back to class...? you've been well and truly corrected here and you clearly and unmistakably wrong.

    I will remain polite on the matter. As I said you can call it a stamp if you like (though it is clearly defined as a hallmark), it's importance clear and paramount, it is the guarantee on the bar.

    Further,
    In hallmarks.... You have a purity mark, a makers mark, a date mark etc. It is not solely a "makers mark" as the definition clears shows.
     
  24. Mr. Shiny

    Mr. Shiny Silver Member Silver Miner

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    So, let me get this straight, Swiss gold is tops....as long as it says 'Essayeur Fondeur'......but, but, but, the Swiss Company Argor Heraeus SA says 'Melter Assayer'.....so it's crap in your book?
    Or for that matter, the Spanish company SEMP (Sociedad Española de Metales Preciosos) which marks their product with 'Fundidores Afinadores' (founders refiners in Spanish) their product is of lower quality in your eyes as well?
    What about Rand Refinery product? No assayer/founder mark, just a springbok and some English words, must not even be real gold.
     
  25. Gcubed

    Gcubed Banned

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    He knows it all Mr. Shiny. The guy deals with them all on a daily basis. We should just shut up. :biggrin:
     
  26. Mr. Shiny

    Mr. Shiny Silver Member Silver Miner

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    Yep, they should know, and I'm pretty darn sure PepsiCo & Coca-Cola, would say the same about their water products. They are the same thing, but "Mine is better"
     
  27. Mr. Shiny

    Mr. Shiny Silver Member Silver Miner

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    My response.
    A hallmark is a logo, a way of distiguishing your product, nothing more. Registered artwork.
    The black circle surrounding the white & blue 90° segments containing the letters B M W is the manufacturers hallmark, not an indication of quality. That's what the series number is for.
    Just like the toe nail clipping is Nike's hallmark.
    Or the three arrows/three circles is Beretta's hallmark.
     
  28. Irons

    Irons Deep Sixed Mother Lode

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    ............


    cry1.gif Laughing_Mouse.gif
     
  29. Oz Waver

    Oz Waver Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    I've never suggested or stated it was 'crap'. You are attempting to put words in my mouth by the use of a 'comparative deletion' that I reject and is clearly false. This is a rather pathetic and childish method of trying to grasp at straws that aren't there.

    What I said was that it was arguably the most recognised and universally accepted hallmark (See post #15), which again you and your partner in crime is saying must be a makers mark and nothing else.
    The very point being as I stated in my original post in this thread normally I say 'gold is gold' however there are more recognisable brands so although Istanbul refinery's gold may be 9999 'pure' the Suisse is arguably more 'recognised' and IMO higher, this does not mean less pure. (continued below)

    I was sure you were going to use this line of logic.
    So for the dummies... (as you guys are clearly here to argue with me)
    I am the one that included the link to the LBMA with good delivery providers. ALL these providers have accredited bars. ALL these bars are required to meet the standards. ALL bars should meet/be technically be as 'good' as one another. No doubt.

    However as I stated earlier some bars have higher recognition value and confidence level, I should specifically say in the retail market (as this is the context I am speaking on). I would argue that Perth Mint, Heraeus, Rand, and the Suisse "essayeur fondeur" stamps from Pamp et al. have a higher 'recognition' than that of the Spanish SEMP. This does not make the product itself inferior in anyway. Also on this point the Suisse bars are of the highest standard and that does not mean others are not on par. Johnson Matthey for example would have IMO the second most recognisable brand/acceptance etc. universally.

    Also you'll find I have in other posts spoken about the Perth Mint having the highest quality bullion products. Does this mean that Perth Mint is better than Pamp, no, IMO they are on par. You can argue which one you prefer and why or which one is more recognised/acceptance or attracts the greatest premium in the context of a particular locale and why.... etc. etc.

    I would argue if you took a 1 oz gold Pamp Sussie Bar and a 1 oz gold Spanish SEMP Bar (if they make one) and travelled around the world, the Pamp bar would attract the greatest premium and be more recognised/accepted. Do you disagree or are all equally accepted in the retail world (where the majority of the world buy)?

    Again, I object to your repeated characterisation of my comments. Perhaps you should re-read them to get the 'flavour' of the message I am conveying. Now do you want to give it a rest?

    One more time, here is the EXACT definition of Hallmark:

    http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/hallmark

    1hall·mark noun \ˈhȯl-ˌmärk\
    1
    a : an official mark stamped on gold and silver articles in England to attest their purity
    b : a mark or device placed or stamped on an article of trade to indicate origin, purity, or genuineness

    http://www.google.com.au/search?cli...gc.r_pw.&fp=441a3109824007d1&biw=1440&bih=780

    A hallmark is an official mark or series of marks struck on items made of precious metals -- platinum, gold, silver and in some nations, palladium. In a more general sense, the term '''' can also be used to refer to any distinguishing characteristic or trait.
    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hallmark

    The mark or marks designating that a piece of metalwork has received an official approval of quality.
    www.galerieversailles.com/page56.html

    A mark stamped or laser-engraved by a country's assay office indicating the quality of the precious metal tested (eg, "Sterling," ".925," ".840," ".800," or an image of a "rampant lion"—as used in Great Britian).
    www.silversmithing.com/glossary.htm

    'Essayeur Fondeur' is the guarantee mark providing 'genuineness', 'official approval of quality' etc. as stated by the Sussie manufacturer (link provided above).

    Please stand corrected.
     
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2011

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