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The U.S. Navy’s Big Mistake — Building Tons of Supercarriers

Discussion in 'Topical Discussions (In Depth)' started by Scorpio, Jan 10, 2017.



  1. Scorpio

    Scorpio Скорпион Founding Member Board Elder Site Mgr Site Supporter ++

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    The U.S. Navy’s Big Mistake — Building Tons of Supercarriers

    The Pentagon behaves as if aircraft carriers will rule forever … they won’t
    by DAVID W. WISE

    This story originally appeared on May 27, 2015. With 314,000 views in 2016, it was our most popular story of the year.

    “History,” it has been written, “does not repeat itself, but it rhymes.” Today it’s rhyming with Gen. Billy Mitchell. In the 1920s, Mitchell challenged conventional thinking by advocating air power at sea in the face of a naval establishment dominated by battleship proponents.

    The hubris of the “battleship Navy” was such that just nine days before Pearl Harbor, the official program for the 1941 Army-Navy game displayed a full page photograph of the battleship USS Arizona with language virtually extolling its invincibility.

    Of course, the reason that no one had yet sunk a battleship from the air — in combat — was that no one had yet tried.

    [​IMG]
    In fact, Mitchell sank a captured German battleship, the Ostfriesland, in an aerial demonstration back in 1921, but the Navy said that the test proved nothing. Two of the observers that day were officials from Japan.

    In addition, the architect of the Pearl Harbor attack, Isoroku Yamamoto, was a student at Harvard at the time and no doubt read accounts of the event that were widely reported in the newspapers.

    The aircraft carrier decisively replaced the battleship as the Navy’s sea control capital ship, but its reign in that capacity was, in reality, quite brief. The aircraft carrier established its ascendancy in the Battle of Midway and was the centerpiece of five major sea battles between 1942 and 1944.

    Yet, following the Battle of Leyte Gulf in 1944, the U.S. Navy repositioned the aircraft carrier as a platform to project power ashore. The United States did not lose a fleet carrier in the war after the Hornet went down in 1942, because Japan’s surface fleet had been devastated. Nor did Tokyo effectively use its submarines.

    That track record, just as the boast in the Army/Navy game program, however, is not an indication that a carrier cannot be sunk — or put out of commission — but rather the fact that since 1945, the U.S. Navy has never engaged another navy in battle that tried.

    “Projecting the past into the future is risky business — especially when we’re unsure what that past was,” James Holmes, a naval warfare expert at the U.S. Naval War College wrote.

    Which brings us to today. The U.S. Navy has fallen into a troubling pattern of designing and acquiring new classes of ships that would arguably best be left as single ship — or at most in limited numbers. It’s also building several types of new aircraft that fail to meet specifications.

    The Navy is developing a new class of supercarriers that cannot function properly, and has designed them to launch F-35 fighters that are not ready to fly their missions. This is all happening during an era of out-of-control budgets, which bodes poorly for American sea power and leadership ahead.

    That the Navy is concentrating larger percentages of its total force structure on large, high signature and increasingly vulnerable ships endangers America’s future. Fortunately, there’s better options to the status quo if the Navy moves now.

    [​IMG]
    At top — the USS Ronald Reagan at sea on Oct. 22, 2008. Above — the USS Gerald R. Ford at dock on Aug. 11, 2013. Navy photos

    much more here:


    https://warisboring.com/the-u-s-nav...tons-of-supercarriers-571c8dad2f29#.euijmie62
     
  2. Professur

    Professur Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Floating IEDs
     
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  3. Thecrensh

    Thecrensh Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    20 years ago, they were force projection. Now, they are targets.
     
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  4. Goldhedge

    Goldhedge Modal Operator/Moderator Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    What was that missile they used off the Falkland Islands?

    The Exocet or something???
     
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  5. Flight2gold

    Flight2gold Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter ++

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    The BrahMos, the world's fastest anti-ship cruise missile in operation was built in a joint venture between Russia and India.
    The Chinese have the Dong Feng-21 and the Iranians have the Sunburn.
    With missiles that travel between Mach 2 and 3 it would be one heck of a shootout.
    Unfortunately, all carriers would be sunk where they floated.
    You only need one missile to make it through the perimeter to probably sink any Naval vessel with the amount of explosives it carries.
    The Persian Gulf, China Sea or any other waterway are potential deathtraps for a carrier.
    Of course, one Nuc and the whole carrier group is gone.
    The reprisal by the US would be humanity ending.
    Hopefully Trump can start to get the militaries budget back into alignment.
     
  6. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Carrier strike groups possess the capacity to launch so many decoys combined with jamming capabilities that will render most missles incapable of reaching the target. Early over the horizon aircraft using radar & other technologies provide tremendous early warning to the carrier group. One or more attack subs & sub seeking aircraft & boats are constantly patrolling the perimeters for threats... The aircraft carrier plays the role of a floating nation, as one carrier carries more first strike "shock & awe" power than most nations....​

    These floating cities & strike platforms will be rendered obsolete in a few decades as more efficient unmanned "drone" ships replace their duties... I suspect that in the future giant solar powered high altitude floating air ships (dirgibles) with tremendous payload capacity will float-n-fly around the globe, armed with unmanned flying drones to provide response & first strike capacity...

    The technology has been developed & is under innovation currently to lift tremendous payloads into the upper atmosphere for prolonged periods of time. (see sscspace.com link below) I suspect most naval activities will be rendered obsolete once these high flying instant strike platforms become operational. Once you eliminate the quartering, feeding & hygenic activities of personell and replace them with drones that do not require the space or personal maintainence, your capable of creating much smaller more efficient surface, sea & air vessles.... you'll never get an aircraft carrier to fly, but you can load up an umanned robotic AI alternative powered controlled dirgible with unmanned drones & missles that can fly around unassisted for years....

    http://www.sscspace.com/products-se...ices-esc/launch-services-esrange-space-center

    This certainly provides new meaning to the phrase "DEATH FROM ABOVE!" And its all been covered up when these vehicles have been sighted as UFO's, etc...

    One additional mention.... solar power appears to be the first choice as these high alt craft would fly above most cloud cover. However they would require very lightweight solar cells & energy storage units akin to batteries in periods of low light & darkness. Could this possibly explain the .gov investments into the solar arena & the race to develope lightweight energy storage units? Which leads to the next ?. Was a new energy source discovered or developed that obsoletes solar power for such craft? Is this why .gov has seemingly abandoned the solar technology arena? HMMM, microgravity comes to mind!

    Micro-Gravity Payloads

    http://www.sscspace.com/products-services/rocket-balloon-services/payloads-sci/microgravity-payloads

    Admitted (nonclassified) Balloon Payload Capacity

    Stratospheric balloons activities
    In 1974 we completed a launching facility for scientific balloons at Esrange Space Center. This facility has been continuously upgraded to enable launches of 1,000,000 m3 balloons with payloads weighing up to many tons. The nominal impact point normally chosen is situated 75 km north of the launch pads. The impact area for balloons covers the northern parts of Sweden, Norway, Finland, Russia, Canada and Alaska.
    Balloon missions

    http://www.sscspace.com/products-se...ices-esc/launch-services-esrange-space-center
     
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  7. Professur

    Professur Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    I'm sure everyone remembers a Chinese sub surfacing in the middle of a carrier group a few years back.
     
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  8. GOLDBRIX

    GOLDBRIX In God I Trust and most in GIM Gold Chaser

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    That was because "Bill the Spill" authorized the State Dept to take a Computerized Milling machine off the No Export List and see it just happen to get sold to Commie China.
    "Spill" said something like - Aw, we're 20-30 years ahead of that technology. It's O.K.

    I bet the "W" Admin and DoD SH!T a squeelin' worm when CHI-COM rose in their midst.

    I say that tech was what the News copter saw West Bound from California:
     
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  9. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    The uninvited guest: Chinese sub pops up in middle of U.S. Navy exercise, leaving military chiefs red-faced

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ercise-leaving-military-chiefs-red-faced.html

    Everytime I read articles like this I clutch my wallet tighter! The ? is was this real or fake news??? Why would the navy even publicly admit to such an embarassing occurrence? If it really happened organically, the top brass would never publicly admit it! CUI BONO???
     
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  10. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    What article? Did you click the link? When I did, there's a page, but no article.
    As for whether it's real or fake, why wouldn't it be real? If the Navy didn't say something about it, it would cause even more embarrassment for the Chinese to say something about it. If something is going to be made public anyways, a lotta times it's better to just admit it and own up to it before they have the chance to do so for you.
    ...and for what it's worth, it didn't surface "in the middle" of the carrier group, but 5 miles away. The truly embarrassing part is the fact it went unnoticed after having surfaced until it was spotted by a routine surveillance flight that saw it just sitting there on the surface.
    What that means is that it would have been possible to get shots off completely undetected from under the surface as well as from above the surface. Considering the amount spent by the US gov on military hardware, this incident speaks volumes.




    As for the article, here's a different one of the same incident.

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2006/nov/13/20061113-121539-3317r/
    A Chinese submarine stalked a U.S. aircraft carrier battle group in the Pacific last month and surfaced within firing range of its torpedoes and missiles before being detected, The Washington Times has learned.

    The surprise encounter highlights China’s continuing efforts to prepare for a future conflict with the U.S., despitePentagon efforts to try to boost relations with Beijing’s communist-ruled military.

    The submarine encounter with the USS Kitty Hawk and its accompanying warships also is an embarrassment to the commander of U.S. forces in the Pacific, Adm. William J. Fallon, who is engaged in an ambitious military exchange program with China aimed at improving relations between the two nations’ militaries.


    Disclosure of the incident comes as Adm. Gary Roughead, commander of the U.S. Navy’s Pacific Fleet, is making his first visit to China. The four-star admiral was scheduled to meet senior Chinese military leaders during the weeklong visit, which began over the weekend.

    According to the defense officials, the Chinese Song-class diesel-powered attack submarine shadowed the Kitty Hawk undetected and surfaced within five miles of the carrier Oct. 26.

    The surfaced submarine was spotted by a routine surveillance flight by one of the carrier group’s planes.



    Something similar happened in '15 also involving the USS Ronald Reagan in the Sea of Japan.
     
  11. GOLDBRIX

    GOLDBRIX In God I Trust and most in GIM Gold Chaser

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    Check the Article's site this was posted outside the U.S. This was news OUTSIDE the U.S.
    American LameStreamMedia kept it on the down-low to the American public.

    Very Little if any American posts on the incident.

    The silent sub launching the missle off California, West-bound, got more American Press than "Red Sub Rising" did.
     
  12. the_shootist

    the_shootist I self identify as a black '69 Camaro Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Well, this just sucked any optimism out of my soul for the day :bomb::blew up:
     
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