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  1. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    They fixed the pipe a couple hours after the incident. I tried to tell them they needed to leave it open to dry out, but they didn't listen to me of course. So like I said tomorrow I'll check the drywall for moisture. If there is any he will be getting a call to inform him to call his liability insurance because I'm gonna call a Restoration Co and git done properly. Wife didn't care much for the color anyway. :-) 8 to 10 grand should cover it so we don't get any mold. If he hadn't been such a a$$hat about it I could have corrected it, but noooo, old man don't know nuttin.

    Check out the article below.
     
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  2. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    Home Depot Panics Over Millennials; Forced To Host Tutorials On Using Tape Measures, Hammering Nails

    As wall street analysts celebrate the coming of age of the millennial generation, a group of young people who were supposed to lead another revolutionary wave of consumerism if only they could work long enough to escape their parents' basement, retailers like Home Depot are panicked about selling into what will soon be America's largest demographic...but not for the reasons you might think.

    While avocado resellers like Whole Foods only have to worry about creating a catchy advertising campaign to attract millennials, Home Depot is in full-on panic mode after realizing that an entire generation of Americans have absolutely no clue how to use their products. As the Wall Street Journal points out, the company has been forced to spend millions to create video tutorials and host in-store classes on how to do everything from using a tape measure to mopping a floor and hammering a nail.

    Home Depot's VP of marketing admits she was originally hesitant because she thought some of their videos might be a bit too "condescending" but she quickly learned they were very necessary for our pampered millennials.

    In June the company introduced a series of online workshops, including videos on how to use a tape measure and how to hide cords, that were so basic some executives worried they were condescending. “You have to start somewhere,” Mr. Decker says.

    Lisa DeStefano, Home Depot vice president of marketing, initially hesitated looking over the list of proposed video lessons, chosen based on high-frequency online search queries. “Were we selling people short? Were these just too obvious?” she says she asked her team. On the tape-measure tutorial, “I said ‘come on, how many things can you say about it?’ ” Ms. DeStefano says.

    And just in case you think we're joking and/or exaggerating, here is Home Depot's tape measure tutorial in all its glory:



    Meanwhile, Scotts Miracle-Gro has been forced to start training classes to remind frustrated millennials, who can't seem to keep their flowers alive, that plants need sunlight to grow (apparently not a single millennial ever took biology in grade school). Commenting on the tutorials, a defeated VP of Corporate Affairs, Jim King, admitted "these are simple things we wouldn’t have really thought to do or needed to do 15 to 20 years ago"...sorry, Mr. King this is your life now.

    The Scotts Miracle-Gro Co. has started offering gardening lessons for young homeowners that cover basic tips—really, really basic—like making sure sunlight can reach plants.

    “These are simple things we wouldn’t have really thought to do or needed to do 15 to 20 years ago,” says Jim King, senior vice president of corporate affairs for Scotts. “But this is a group who may not have grown up putting their hands in the dirt growing their vegetable garden in mom and dad’s backyard.”

    “They grew up playing soccer, having dance recitals and playing an Xbox,” says Scott’s Mr. King. “They probably didn’t spend as much time helping mom and dad out in the yard as their predecessors or their predecessors’ predecessors.”

    Companies such as Scotts, Home Depot Inc., Procter & Gamble Co. , Williams-Sonoma Inc.’s West Elm and the Sherwin-Williams Co. are hosting classes and online tutorials to teach such basic skills as how to mow the lawn, use a tape measure, mop a floor, hammer a nail and pick a paint color.

    Unfortunately, at least for the Home Depots of the world, millennials now represent the largest demographic in America with 4.75 million 26 year olds roaming the streets of New York, San Francisco and Los Angeles without a clue as to how to use a tape measure.

    The biggest single age cohort today in the U.S. is 26-year-olds, who number 4.8 million, according to Torsten Slok, chief international economist for Deutsche Bank . People 25, 27 and 24 follow close behind, in that order. Many are on the verge of life-defining moments such as choosing a career, buying a house and having children.

    Millennials as a whole are America’s latest demographic bubble, overtaking the baby boom generation and, like them, transforming popular culture, retailing, media and lifestyles. They make up about 42% of all home buyers today, and 71% of all first-time home buyers, according to Zillow Group . Some 86% of millennial home buyers reported making at least one improvement to their home in the past year, more than any other generation, Zillow says.

    [​IMG]
    While we have our doubts that it will save their business, retailers like J.C. Penney and West Elm are trying to adapt to the millennial generation by offering basic in-home services like installing televisions or hanging wall art.

    J.C. Penney Co. says the group is willing to hire others for projects. The retailer has pushed into home services, including furnace and air-conditioning repair, water-treatment systems and bathroom renovations, and expanded its window-covering installation.

    “They’re much more of a ‘Do-It-for-Me’ type of customer than a ‘Do-It-Yourself’ customer,” says Joe McFarland, executive vice president of J.C. Penney stores. “You don’t need a ladder or a power drill, you don’t even have to wonder if you measured your window right.”

    Home-furnishings retailer West Elm offers service packages, which start at $129, to provide plumbing and electrical work, painting, installing a television and hanging wall art and mirrors.

    [​IMG]
    All that said, at least some millennials are trying to be more self-sufficient...as an example, the WSJ notes the case of 26-year-old Breanne Loes who recently borrowed her dad's power tools to craft a wooden headboard...which went really well AFTER she realized the saw blade was on backwards.

    Ms. Loes enjoys do-it-yourself projects, and two summers ago built with her now-husband a wooden headboard in her parents’ garage, with help from an online tutorial, her dad, two older brothers and their tools.

    The saw wasn’t working at first because the blade was backward. “That was embarrassing,” says Ms. Loes.

    Congrats, Breanne, really great job...really.
     
  3. andial

    andial Sir Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    Good article, my son (26) is a hit with his friends cause he worked with me all through his teens up until a couple years ago. One day he tells me one of his friends didn't even know how to use a caulking gun.
     
  4. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    Every one of my dad's brothers were builders. They would all jump in for the framing and roof then go back to their own projects. Dad would help out on weekends and I'd tag along. Got blown off a ladder at 12 pushing up a sheet of plywood up to the second story of a cape uncle Dale was building. Each brother would build a house a year alone 90% of the time. That's how they lived, most times someone would see a house being built and would inquire about it, and if any of the Moron brothers were building it they would buy it as soon as the roof went on. Dad was a tool and die maker but could build anything, even cabinets. SIL and his whole family are builders, so was my BIL. It's in the genes I guess.
     
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  5. Lt Dan

    Lt Dan Gold Pirate Gold Chaser

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    Reminds me of this old clip.

     
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  6. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    I thought tape measures were used to see how long we've been there. Any of you'se guys got one of these in your every day tool box?
    folding ruler.jpg
     
  7. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    Damn, man. I hate when that happens. I couldn't have done that if I tried.

    Came back to a siding job one day and my helper told me he heard a crash inside the house 10 minutes earlier. Done knocked a shelving unit off the wall. House was a kit house. I believe you could order them from a catalog. Walls were 2x3 studs shipped as panels that got bolted together on site. 3/8" sheathing on walls and roof deck. Built on slab. The whole neighborhood was like that.

    Which breminds me. A friend was helping secure an entry door in that neighborhood. He drove a 3" screw into the top hinge. Being that these were built on slabs, the water heater pipes ran up along the door frame and over the header. I'll leave the rest of the story for you all to figure out.
     
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  8. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Naw smooth, it wasn't you. I was just trying to get the guys to pull up their outlook. The target range thingy in Las Vegas is pretty depressing — I'm still trying to get my head around that. Cheer up everyone, the end is near.

    HH — I got one of those folding rulers but not one with the little brass scale insert.

    BF
     
  9. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    The guy I use for plumbing is the only person I know that use wood rulers faithfully. They sell good on amazon. A extended warranty can be had for a fifth of the purchase price.
     
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  10. smooth

    smooth Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    So... here is what my partner has been working on the last couple of weeks.....
    smart pig.jpeg
    This is the crude oil line at one of the crude tanks thats been specially fitted to "receive" this device we call a Smart Pig. The smart pig is launched from our terminal 3 miles away and slowly forced through the pipe using hydraulic differential pressure. It's a very expensive piece of equipment that is only launched after several runs with cleaning pigs. It measures and records the thickness of the pipe wall 360 degrees and detects other various anomalies. The prep work and planning going into this has been immense, with the idea that if there are any flaws found in those three miles, the line could be made ready to work on in short order. I cant even explain the work He put into this.
     
  11. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    I washed a fence today.
     
  12. Lt Dan

    Lt Dan Gold Pirate Gold Chaser

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    I use one for plumbing work similar to the one you pictured above, but mine is specific for plumbing, if you measure the distance between two runs, flip the rule over, it gives you the length of a pipe if you're wanting to join them on a 45 degree. I can explain it to you and show how it works, but can't understand it for you. Also have another like the one pictured with the brass slide. And, yes, still another for measuring board feet in a log, same deal, can't make you understand how it works.

    Oh, and I wired in a new furnace for a guy today, and sawed some firewood - for myself.
     
  13. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    I took a nap today, does that count?
     
  14. Lt Dan

    Lt Dan Gold Pirate Gold Chaser

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    Never ever let work interfere with nap time. chopper.gif
     
  15. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Aw, you guys would need to go over to the computers thread to see what I've been doin.
    Oh, that and the never-ending thread in the cigar room :D:D

    And, mayhem, you deserve a nap, especially after all the BS you've been through there.

    BF
     
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  16. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    Thursday morning update, well afternoon really.

    Got out the trusty moisture meter this morning to check how much moisture the drywall in the bathroom where he nailed the pipe to see what the moisture content was. Well golleee, 50% at the base and 21% at the 4 foot level. Called the contractor and told him to call his insurance company and tell them that I need a water restoration company in here to tear out that 1/2 bath and maybe the two closets that are on either side. He didn't want to do that and suggested I allow him to dry out the area from the outside.
    That stupid idea I didn't comment on, but the humidity here is 89% and how is that going to dry out anything. Then he said he wanted to send hi guys over here to do something, I wasn't listening. I told him I would only accept a third party water extraction company who had the proper equipment to do the job right.
    Having been in that business, I can tell you that all the drywall that is holding moisture needs to be removed first, then the studs and outer plywood can be dried out from the inside. Water got under the tile so that has to be removed along with the sink and toilet. This will be a costly job and he tried to get me to agree to allowing his screwups to fix it. I promptly said NO and told him I will get a lawyer involved if he doesn't do it with a third party.
    Plus the walls are Venetian Plaster (sic expensive finish) and can't be patched. So I'm waiting on him now. Gonna be busy tomorrow with a PET Scan most of the day. I'll be back later.
     
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  17. andial

    andial Sir Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    mayhem do you have a photo of the plumbing plus what size nails was the guy using to install the sheathing i want to get to the bottom of this.
     
  18. ttazzman

    ttazzman Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter

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    mayhem.....just curious....is the sheet rock ...std...mr...or ?? ....in your experience how does sheet rocks other than standard perform when they get wet?

    and just a note on your "probable" case.....be sure and have everything pre-verified by a third party....and personally i would just call MY/Your insurance company and put in a claim and let them go after the contractor if applicable...and i hope you got a insurance certificate before they came on the job if not i have seen small LLCs with no insurance just fold their company tent one day and open another LLC the next day to get away from something like this..its also very common for small guys like this to falsify insurance certificates
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2017
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  19. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    No photo. He claims it was a pipe coming up from the slab through the bottom plate. I don't agree with him but I'm holding off until he tells me to either get lost or someone calls me from a water restoration company. They covered everything up on the outside because it was raining pretty hard and the area is right above the roof runoff onto concrete, so there would be some splashing. I'm watching him hang himself here. He doesn't want to make a claim, and I understand why, they will jack him sky high next year. He wanted to solve it himself, and I could have guided him on how to do it properly, but then I would be involved and I no longer have my cert for water damage and mold, plus I no longer have my dehumidifiers and fans.
    What he should have done was the first thing this morning was to rent a dehumidifier run it over here remove the toilet and sink and cut out the drywall, closed and tape off the opening with the dehumidifier running inside. Then check the two closets with my meter, and do the same if needed. I just can't get around to do the simplest of s#it, or I would have done it myself. Both the wife and I are pretty bad health wise. For me it's a really busted up back that they can't operate on any longer. Plus I found out last Thurs that I have lung cancer, and tomorrow I start to run the gauntlet of tests to see how bad it is. The wife just got released from the hospital (a week ago) after a bad A-Fib incident, and needs a heart valve replacement that is in the works.
    The other problem is his two workers. One is a prima-donna, 30 sumptin who can not be told anything, and while he does nice work he refuses any criticism or suggestions. The one who nailed the pipe is a good helper, but learning bad habits from the lead guy.
    What size nails? Hmm, I would have to look, but I'm assuming they are 2 or 2 1/2" ringshanks.
    These guy came highly recommended to me from two friends whom I trust as dependable sober, and always show up on time, which they did. That is a big plus down here in the land of fun in the sun. The owner is a really nice guy, and listens well, and is shook up pretty bad about this. I can be pressing when needed without making a a$$ of myself, that has always been my strong suit, and I'm pressing him pretty hard, very politely, not giving any ground. He is the one being squeezed from his side not me.
     
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  20. smooth

    smooth Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Sorry about the diagnosis Mayhem. Take care of yourself first bro..
     
  21. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    Standard 1/2 drywall. No bath or shower so no need for anything else. Anyway back in 88 the only choice would have been green board and it isn't any better beyond the the top sheet of green paper. When wet it soaks up water like a sponge, and should be replace if wet for any legenth of time.
    The reason I want a water removal company involved.
    If I contact my insurance Co. it will be a guaranteed 20% rate hike no matter who is at fault. That's what others have experienced, and regretted ever contacting them.
    Oh yes. Been there done that. you don't live as long as I have and not learned a few lessons.
     
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  22. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    Sorry the power went out 30 minutes ago as I was typing the last post. It's been going out about 5 times a day ever since they installed those smart meters. Becoming a real PITA.
     
  23. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    Sir smooth it will take a lot to break me. I have already decided that I will go with radiation, but no chemo. I'm to old, and quality of life is more important than the misery that chemo puts ya through. If I was younger it might be different, but not at my age.
    I could share a story with y'all that even numbers wouldn't believe. :secret:
     
  24. spinalcracker

    spinalcracker On a mail train. Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    Mayhem , healing vibes and positive thoughts to you and your wife ...
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2017 at 5:47 AM
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  25. andial

    andial Sir Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    Understood mayhem i just wish like you said open the wall in the bathroom behind toilet/sink let it dry, close her up, reinstall the sink and toilet, problem solved.
     
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  26. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    It's a given that the interior wall coverings should be removed and replaced. Just curious, what is moisture reading in rooms further away from damaged area?
     
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  27. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Oh man, mayhem, it just keeps getting worse. Hope for the best on your cancer tests, just damn. Prayers for you and your wife this AM.

    BF
     
  28. andial

    andial Sir Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    IMG_0768.JPG
     
  29. smooth

    smooth Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Ok... Also not my job. But I've been involved in shit like this before and it's a perfect example of when you forget about all the small shit and pay close attention to every little move you make. Know your limitations, plan every movement, and always be in a situation where if something comes up you can just stop. In short, you move very slow.
    piping lift 2.jpg
    Replacing 30" pipe below some high voltage lines. Yes, the crane is stretched above the lines. the pipe was cut then lowered, spun, then loaded on a trailer in two 40' foot lengths. Then the new pipe was hauled below the hook, raised, spun and fit into place.
    piping lift.jpg
    Several of the lines were taken out of service before the lifts, some had to remain hot, but were insulated in preparation to this work. Several hundred feet of this line is being replaced through the plant by different crews. But for this segment a select few were even allowed in the area.
     
  30. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    Looks nerve wracking.
     
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  31. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    I would if I physically could. Monday I have to do a biopsy. If I'm feeling up to it ( and I haven't been feeling very well) when I get home I'm gonna call a water restoration company and have them do just that, Tue at the latest. Put in a couple of dehumidifier's and fans to dry it out. His insurance company has a horrible rep on sending out appraisers and doing the right thing. So I'll spring for the cost out of pocket, and hire an attorney to sue for recovery. He texted me from CO. this morning saying he won't be back until the 22nd. Also I have a call into the person who's license he is using. If a lite conversation with whoever it is doesn't work out, I will include them in the lawsuit.
    There is a closet that also might be effected and it has a lot of stuff in it that the wife and I can't physically remove quickly, so there is that also.
     
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  32. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    Like I said above I can't get to the wall in the closet. But my experiences and I have years at this says it will read 40% or more at the base, and prolly 20% at 4 foot mark like the bathroom.
    The wall isn't a covering. It is a three layer plaster of different shades creating a marble look. Then it has a polyurethane coating over the top that slicks out with a 6 inch drywall knife in a circular motion until enough heat from friction makes it shine like marble. The closet is just eggshell paint.
     
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  33. mayhem

    mayhem Rebel Fire Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    Thank you sir.
     
  34. Hystckndle

    Hystckndle Daguerreotype Fanatic Site Mgr Site Supporter ++

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    Yes,
    The 100% wood ones
    ( as in ones without the metal stretchers
    come in handy...
    as in more than handy...essential tool )
    when working in existing buildings in
    existing switchgear that is operational.
    Sometimes mods require custom electrical bus
    or the factory needs some # s cuz the existing stuff either ain't in their database or is as old as Andial and me ( 57 ) and they didn't have a data base then.
    Huh !?
    Hows about that ?
    Didn t think anyone carried them anymore.
    Much less used them.
    However,
    Withe new NFPA and insurance junk....
    It has become more and more sub work just to look at it.
    So it gets used less often.
    Regards to all,
     
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  35. D-FENZ

    D-FENZ Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

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    Years ago when I was doing my plumbing apprenticeship, the old guy who was my foreman used one of those. I don't think he even had a tape. I never could figure out how to properly use the thing- nor wanted to. I could always have the piece of pipe that he needed, cut and waiting to hand to him before he had that thing folded up and back into his pocket. I came to resent it.

    For a 45 there is a simple "common" to use as a multiplier. Take the centerline offset and multiply by 1.41. Subtract the fitting make-up and there is your number. For common radius fittings, make-up is the size of pipe you are using. For example, on a 3" DWV (drain, waste, vent) 45, the center to make-up is 1-1/2". Since 2 are generally needed for the connection, you would subtract 3".
     
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  36. spinalcracker

    spinalcracker On a mail train. Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    Ha!..I love me some construction math.
    We learned how to figure how much concrete was needed for the job.
    1 yard of concrete will cover 81 sq ft at 4" inches thick.
    Or , 1 yd of concrete will cover 27 sq ft at 1' foot thick.
    In my younger days as a cub , I would be over there with my pencil and paper figuring out how much mud to order and one of the older journeyman would just look at the size of the pour and say off the top of their head , "looks like about 14 yds will do it."...
    Right again.
    Figuring concrete for pyramids , cylinders , and steps were a challenge.
    I think the pipe fitters used more math than carpenters.
    I never used algebra on the job once in my career.
     
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  37. Lt Dan

    Lt Dan Gold Pirate Gold Chaser

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    Well, yes, the formula works all the time, whereas the ruler only works if you know how to use it. I'd piss off helpers all the time with tricks I'd picked up from the old guys. Throw out a formula at 'em and have them scratching their heads, trying to figure out what language you were speaking. I took geometry and physics in high school, math came easy for me, some helpers only took general math in HS and had no clue what I was saying. Some helpers made it in the trades, some never did.

    I worked with one old guy who would ask me for my tape measure if he had a pipe to cut over 6' as his ruler only went to 6'. Most of the time he didn't even use a ruler, he's just hold up a piece, eye it and cut off what he needed. That really baffled the helpers, as he never missed, it was always just right.
     
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  38. ttazzman

    ttazzman Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter

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    The importance of getting plumbing cut right the first time certainly changed with the move to pvc...from cast
     
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  39. andial

    andial Sir Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    Got it mayhem good luck with that test. By the way you guys are starting to make me feel like a young whippersnapper when this thread started i thought i was an old feck apprentice.
     
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  40. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Congratulations on your new photography skills Sir dial. Did you switch cameras with stonedy?

    :D:D
    BF
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2017 at 1:50 PM
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